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doghows
12-11-2013, 01:03 PM
Good news I found a shop that had my kit in stock [yay]. Ordered it and should have it this time next week.

On a side note I have Gina's comet at the house and it looks like an engine swap is upcoming. So get ready for a tech day.

Will post up when and, of course, it's over here again.

BPVan
12-11-2013, 01:05 PM
Let us know when the 302 is ready to drop in:rocker:

doghows
12-11-2013, 01:07 PM
Yeah right. 170 for170 on this one.

But maybe we'll put my rack in on the same day??? Hmmmm pizza anyone.

Gina K
12-11-2013, 02:43 PM
Got the gasket set and freeze plugs for it today. Pizza will be on me, it's the least I can do. The falcon is making more noises by the day 😪 she just needs a new home and someone to give her some TLC. Keep in touch Steve as we will need to get Miles and I out before tech day and get the prep done.

doghows
12-11-2013, 02:56 PM
Ok I'll start a new thread on this cause we're detracting from my delivery now. lol:D

doghows
12-12-2013, 09:50 AM
Ok here we go again... We have a big project coming up and possibly a medium size one..

Project #1: Gina's Comet is at my house and awaiting an engine transplant. We have a replacement motor that will be reassembled soon, so the swap out will probably be engine for engine.. Hopefully we'll have it ready to go so it should be fairly painless.

Project #2 I finally found a rack and pinion kit for my car and it is in route now. So we might be doing a swap out on the steering system on the delivery at the same time.

If anyone is interested in either of these two projects or just wants to come over to BS with us, keep an eye on this thread for more info and dates. I think we want to get both done before the end of the year.
Ill keep you all posted and keep on Falconing..[thumb]

falcon cobra
12-12-2013, 03:29 PM
Hi steve, I would like to help with your steering and the comet but I'am not sure this month with all the christmas stuff going on is going to work for anyone. we will see. and I don't know why there is always the same people that show up, whats the matter with others who have recieved help on there projects that can't go and get there lilly whites dirty, I think there is always something to do to help. this is a club that we are here to help others I thought....jh

Luva65wagon
12-12-2013, 04:39 PM
I still have the heads and the carb work to do for the Comet, but I'm thinking Gina will not want to do the hardened valve seat job. We're talking about $450 to do a complete valve job.

So I am still planning to pull the newer of the two heads apart and see to what level it was rebuilt. Maybe it had hardened seats installed already. Should know by weeks end.

We'll see what we can do and when. It's gonna be hard to fit in, but if we can get 3 or 4 peeps, that should suffice - assuming we get as much of the motor together and the other out prior to the tech day. Same with the steering bits on the SD.

Stay tuned!

doghows
12-12-2013, 05:05 PM
Yup this is just a preemptive post to get the interest up. Not sure when it will all happen, but I plan on pulling my steering off this weekend and maybe getting Ginas car out of the trailer and pull whats left of her engine out? Well see what the weather allows..
Stayed tuned kiddy's. :WHATTHE:

SmithKid
12-12-2013, 05:49 PM
Thankfully you haven't mentioned the Tech Day being this coming week-end, so..... I will try my best to make it! I'll be in Pt. Townsand this Saturday (14th). So if anything needs to be ferried across, let me know. If I can get my pedals and z-bar out in time, I may be bringing you a small powder coat job.

BillP 98201
12-13-2013, 08:48 AM
I'm free to help any time next month. ( except the 20 to the30th)The reason I don't show in the summer time is my job John. If any one needs help Jan or Feb I'm glad to help :)

Gina K
12-13-2013, 03:20 PM
Steve,if you do end up doing any engine work this week end on the Comet let me know so I can send Miles out to help. I gotta work but he is around and willing.

doghows
12-13-2013, 04:05 PM
Will do, kinda up in the air as far as plans right now.

redfalken
12-13-2013, 07:21 PM
...and I don't know why there is always the same people that show up, whats the matter with others who have recieved help on there projects that can't go and get there lilly whites dirty, I think there is always something to do to help. this is a club that we are here to help others I thought....jh

People do what they can. Not everyone is retired. Some people pay their annual club dues as a way to help out...know what I mean?

Luva65wagon
12-14-2013, 01:21 AM
I pulled the "reworked head" apart tonight - and it has to be one of the worst valve jobs I've ever seen.

I was hopeful on the first couple valves I pulled out to clean and inspect, but as I moved east and pulled the 5th valve (exhaust) it looked like the stone they used to grind it needed to be refaced, but they just kept grinding valves with it anyway. Either that or 'the apprentice' took over after being shown a few to get him going. The seats look OK, though there was some water that got in after it was assembled and pooled against the valve. Minor pitting. The guides have been knurled and then reamed. Typically a means to making sloppy clearance tight again, but now with half the surface area as before. Poor-mans valve job all the way.

Suffice it to say I'm a little torn as to what to do about it and with it. I don't like it as is. The valves should be re-refaced at the very least. Can be done and then hand-lapped for some amount of money (my local machine shop charges $5.50 per valve and there are 12 of them - or $66).

The original Comet head would probably need a basic valve job ($170 minimum), though I have not put it up on the bench yet. With the wear in the motor, that head should be reworked if used. I will do an inspection tomorrow I suspect.

Finally there is the 200 Ranchero head. It is a direct bolt-on and will give slightly better breathing due to slightly larger valves. It ran good and didn't burn any oil when I was driving it. May be a use as-is thing. I've got to address what to do with that motor and parts anyway, so I may pull the head on it and give it a look-see.

Bottom-line is that it is clear the reworked 170 head had been running before it was then taken apart. Why was this? What caused them to assemble the motor, run it, then take it apart (they pulled the head anyway.) Maybe it wasn't running good because of this valve job? Can't imagine it would have run good.

More tomorrow. Just letting you know what I see so far.

Gina K
12-14-2013, 06:25 PM
Thanks for the detailed update and the perseverance!🏁
Wish things could be easier but I'm finding out they almost never are.

BPVan
12-15-2013, 09:53 PM
I had my head done at Action Machine and got the updated seals per Kenny's recommendation. I think they did a real good job, sold me all of the rockers as well. Might be worth the money to have them do it. Sometimes the money outweighs the headaches.

Is there a proposed tech day for this or anything else?

doghows
12-15-2013, 10:05 PM
Probably soon Brian. My rack will be here Tuesday and I think as soon as the head issue is worked out we will be swapping engines in Gina's comet..
Ill post up details when we iron them out. Might be hard due to the holidays and so forth.

Luva65wagon
12-16-2013, 01:36 PM
Still need to get back to the head work. I may try and lap the valves and see what pattern I get with them. Just don't like the looks of 'em though. My valve spring compressor takes so much time to operate. Spend more time messing with it than anything else. Should someday buy one like this:

doghows
12-17-2013, 01:52 PM
Just a heads up, I think I'm closing the shop on Thursday and Friday after Christmas. Momma needs some time off. ( me too ) anyway if anyone has some time to waste I am going to tear into Gina's car and get it ready for the engine swap. And if I haven't got it done my rack and pinion is going in as well as the rest of my parts. I need to drive my car.
I don't think we'll be ready to drop the new motor in but who knows???
Ok back to you regularly scheduled program. :D

Gina K
12-17-2013, 03:00 PM
Woks for me, those are my days off. Finally good timing😺Miles and I will be there to get started. I want to drive my car too!!!!!

doghows
12-17-2013, 03:13 PM
Ok we'll see if anyone else has those days off. I know I want to get a lot done but need to keep momma happy too.
Anyone else??

Luva65wagon
12-17-2013, 05:21 PM
I've got some days off, but my list is very long. I may be able to come out that Friday. The thinking in my head is one day to do some work on assembling the motor and then another to put it in the car. I just do not see this all happening in one day.

There is a BIG part of me, after seeing the head work, that says we disassemble the motor, clean things that way, then reassemble with mass quantities of assembly lube. We do not know how long it has sat and what may have crawled up inside. I found a dead spider in one valve. Not bad in a head as much as it might have been in an oil galley.

So - save that for me and look at getting the other motor out, along with the transmission. We'll then be able to look at all the gaskets and seals on it and replace all the fluids when we put it all back in.

Steve - do you have an engine hoist and leveler?

doghows
12-17-2013, 05:56 PM
I have an engine hoist but not a leveler. Isn't there a club one floating around?? haha Just kidding.
Maybe we should have a team pulling the old junk out, and a team pulling the replacement apart. Might be able to get everything ready and then just a day to put it all together..
If all goes well we can stuff it in before the end of the year.. So lets plan for Friday at my shop around 9:30 -10:00 am.. If you need directions PM me..:rocker:

SmithKid
12-17-2013, 06:32 PM
I have another project lined up with my son and suspect I won't make the Friday after Christmas get together, but will plan as best I can for the next one (installation). Please post that date ASAP too.

doghows
12-17-2013, 07:10 PM
Sounds good Gene we knew that weekend would be hard for most. I'll post up as soon as we know. By the way check the powder done cheap thread.

Luva65wagon
12-20-2013, 11:29 PM
Having now taken three heads apart - the orange 170 head is the only one I remotely feel comfortable using - and that only slightly. I pulled the head off my Flarechero 200 as well only to discover it is a 170 head - not a 200 head. Explains a lot - never felt it breathed well with the Weber. It needs a valve job as bad as Gina's from her original engine. Valve guide are shot. I have a 200 head given to me by Thor a number of year ago, but it needs a valve job too. So, we got what we got and we'll just have to use it - or throw money at something. I've put new valve seals in it since I had them...

doghows
12-23-2013, 01:03 PM
So I'm going to say tech day Friday the 27th. My shop 9:30-10:00am. We have Gina's engine stuff to deal with and I have my rack to put in as well as a few other things if we have a few people show. Gina's engine will be our main focus but to avoid tripping over each other I'll have my stuff for backup.
Unless Roger gives it the thumbs down due to lack of parts we are a go. If you need directions send me a pm or maybe carpool it up. See you there and MERRY CHRISTMAS!!:rocker:

Luva65wagon
12-23-2013, 02:05 PM
My plan is still to drive over on Friday the 27th. If anyone wants to join me and isn't on a strict "got to return by... X" - let me know and you can ride over and save money on gas/ferry.

After discussing the cylinder head situation with Gina on Saturday I will be taking the (was supposed to be a 200) 170 head from off the Ranchero into Action Machine today to get a rebuild started on it. With the holidays, have no clue right now about an ETA. More on that when I know.

For what it is worth I took 4 heads apart last week and inspected each of them. Though the orange one supplied with the new motor was a regrind - it was horrific. It will not even be a contender because of the exhaust port crack repair. Gina doesn't want to use it. Wouldn't make a difference at this point, since all 4 would need a regrind - and it a re-regrind.

So the Ranchero head was chosen, being a 63 (C3) version, it has a couple benefits over the C1 heads. Larger carb opening to better accept the Autolite 1100 (and base flange) we'll be putting back on and the improved exhaust port design. Valve are identical size on all three 170 heads.

I wanted to use the 200 head Thor gave me, but as I took it apart I noticed 2 broken exhaust studs and a water outlet bolt had broken and someone brazed another stud into the hole. And though these things are not that big an issue, they would have added at least another few hours onto my already ever-growing list. If I had other 200 heads to choose from, I would have preferred to use a 200 head.

So, as of today the plan is for me - myself - and I - to disassemble the 170 on the stand, clean it, lube it, and reassemble it with everything less the head. No need for you - or anyone else - to mess with the motor. I want to do it forensic style.

All the other of you who (find it possible) to come, can help get the motor and transmission out of Gina's car and then work to clean the engine bay in preparation to reinstall the other motor. We will be inspecting the transmission gaskets and seals to see if we can fix any obvious leaks. This should be accommodated by having the correct transmission pan gasket and filter and rear-extension seal at the very least. If it is leaking anywhere else... silicone will be our friend.

So start looking for these parts now so we can move this as far as we can in the first day. When the head is done and picked up I will arrange another day to come back over and put it on and do the start-up.

And of course, we can help Steve too as much as possible. His shop is an asset and we should make it worth his while to offer it up for use.

doghows
12-23-2013, 03:31 PM
Wow that was a story. I agree Roger one chef in that kitchen will be enough. There will be plenty of stuff to get your hands on so just let me know if you're coming so we can plan lunch and drinks. :shift:

Luva65wagon
12-23-2013, 03:54 PM
Wow that was a story.

I know - sorry.

Just making sure people know that, the plan that is, doesn't always just fall into place. It sometimes requires hours and days to make these old cars live again.

BillP 98201
12-24-2013, 03:54 PM
I'm free if any one needs a hand

doghows
12-24-2013, 04:13 PM
Come on over Bill. So far I think Roger is the only confirmed one so far. You could car pool? We will be pulling the rest of Gina's engine while Roger dissects the engine I have here.
Plus the rack on mine and a few other things. Hope you can make it.

Here is a list of things we want to get done:
Remove the last of Gina's engine, and prep engine bay for replacement motor.
Check Gina's transmission for leaks or needed repairs while engine is out.

Rack and pinion into the delivery
Wipers into delivery
Stereo into delivery
Glovebox into delivery
Ashtray into delivery
Seat back into delivery (for the tenth time)

And I'm sure I'm missing something but as you can see there is a lot to do still. Even if young want to come over for moral support or to see some of the work being done all are welcome. I've got sodas and water, and we'll figure out lunch. Probably get some pizzas.
Ok that's it for now chime in if you want to come over catch a ride or????

MERRY CHRISTMAS everyone. Steve, Laurie, and Ziva.

pbrown
12-25-2013, 04:06 PM
I would love to help but am in Germany at the moment.

dhbfaster
12-25-2013, 06:53 PM
I would also love to be there and help (and learn to ) take an engine out), but we're gone for the holidays... And then off to china for a couple weeks.I hope there are more tech days I can make it to this spring. Have fun!

doghows
12-25-2013, 08:04 PM
Patrick swing by and say hi to my two nieces, one lives there and the other is visiting. China!?! I got to go to Canada once?
We will still have an install day I think so stay tuned. Enjoy the holidays and bring us back some trinkets for our cars..

BillP 98201
12-27-2013, 08:45 PM
I didn't see any postings from any one about when they were leaving or anything. I don't want to get in anyone's way.:NERVOUS:

doghows
12-27-2013, 09:11 PM
Roger was the only across the water person here.. Gina and her son Milo were here, and our good lob buddy Bill was here about 3 weeks out from have info his 4 way bypass done, he was looking good..
Anyway we got Gina's engine out, the replacement block inspected and cleaned, and I got my rack almost completely installed. So it was a pretty productive day.
I think we will have one more in a couple weekends to finish the motor swap. I should have mine done by Sunday and then it's test driving time! Hopefully down to the last few items on mine...
Anyway stay tuned and I will put up the date for the next one..:rocker: