Fast?

This weekend since we are getting some light rain in California I was wondering something I never questioned before.

my 64 Falcon Convertible runs great (170 with Ford O matic). While she runs great and has great compression, what should be a safe top speed to drive her on the highway. I am no speed demon and have no intentions on blowing up my 170cid sewing machine-like engine but I wonder, when this Falcon was brand new, how fast could you really drive her, 55?, 65?, 70?. I’ve never given it much thought as she cruises the streets just fine but when the occasional car show is in another city, these same old questions pop up in my head. Should I be taking the streets? Can I take the freeway (slow lane only)? How far should I push her?

Maybe the 1 barrel carb is undersized but seems like driving on the highway with the pedal almost floored I am only able to get her up to 60-65 mph. At that speed I think I am doing about 2700-3000 rpm. So the questions are:

is my Autolite carburetor undersized?
is my stock rear end over geared (somehow)?

On the TFFN forum there was a thread about this. Terry L. Rahn who was a very respected poster there (sadly passed away last year) stated that the 170 with 4 main bearings shouldn't be operated for long periods over 3000 rpm.
I personally drive my 170 six with manual 3 not faster than 90 - 100 km/H (55 - 62 mph).
Since I do not have a tach installed that's my max go to speed on the highway.
Personally I find local B roads are much more pleasant driving with speeds between to 37-50 mph.
Dutch Highway traffic can be very inconsiderate when it comes to dealing with olditimers. Everybody seems to thing you've got the brake system of the latest VW Golf GTI.

Ps the fordomatic was also dubbed on the TFFN forum as the ford slush-o-matic.

What I did discover a few years ago, when I was having acceleration troubles is that a fine tune for the ingition can do wonders.
I advaced the timing over factory specs.
The other thing that can add a little punch is installing "sport" mufflers. I replaced part of the pipe (from just past the bend over the rear axle) with a little bigger diameter and a better flowing muffler and I had a peppier car with better milage.

Quite a multi-faceted question. Speed, or max speed, is relative to the RPM capability of the engine - as well as the gearing. Even the slush-o-matic (Ford-o-matic) has 1-1 gearing in the final drive, but the rear ratio (typically 3.5 or so) was standard. And speed limits then were 70 if I recall correctly and the car was built to allow for maximum highway speeds at the time. Problem now is everyone you are driving around can do 100 mph without thinking and can stop way better than you can. So it's not only what your car can handle, but what will others do around you. I know your concern is about exploding your motor, which is understandable, but the expectation of those around you may be less than the ideal of what the reality of what your car is capable of. Even though I have a 347 and can probably keep up with traffic - even with the modifications I've made - the cars around me are far better suited for the conditions we find ourselves in.

So, I say, regardless of what your motor is capable of - stay in the slow lane and enjoy your car and you'll get more people passing you and giving you a thumbs-up.

Just to throw a monkey wrench in the story. I am buying a sweatshirt that has a drag racing Christmas tree with these words. "If you car doesn't scare you a little bit, then it isn't fast enough".
I remember when we bought the 64 Falcon for my son 28 years ago and I drove it home. The only thing that scared the crap out of me was it's inability to STOP.
NOW, I don't think anyone get's upset seeing an older car driving in the slow lane on the freeway. I see it all the time and I just enjoy seeing them driving along.
Which, brings up a story. When I finished the 64 and took it to Hot August Nights in Reno, my brother and our wives were staying in Carson City south of Reno. One evening on our way back from showing the cars to our motorhomes I decided to see what the top speed might be (no wifey along). HUGE freeway devoid of traffic so I got it to well over 100 when I noticed a cop coming over the hill ahead. NOW, that scared me! The cop, not the speed.
The Falcons whether stock with original drivelines or the sinister drag and track vehicles are beautiful cars. The key, is do what makes you happy and content with what YOU want. Forget what others think. Larry

Yes, in deed, you are all correct. These Falcons are quite the gem and there is NO need to speed. If I needed to speed I would just take the next set of keys that are hanging in the key box. And thank you for validating what I always felt was the top safe speed without straining the motor. I think my problem is that my 64 has been so reliable when I take her out that I do not appreciate her as much as I should. About 4 years ago I was on my way to Simi Valley for a car show put together by the local Mustang's club. Well as you would have it that day at 8am the temperature was already 95+ degrees. The off ramp was backed up as everyone going to the show was waiting in the longest like of trailer queens. I remember being upset that a couple miles back the american flag I had tied to my antennae mast managed to snap the whole antennae from the heavy fluttering. As we were waiting for some 40+ minutes to enter the event it seemed that every other car was starting to pull over to pop open their hood as they started overheating. One after another started dropping like flies. While I was concerned about when I would have to pull over and do the same thing, she never heated up, she was running a tad warm but we made it in to the event unlike others whose cars were billowing steam and such. My girl has a few peculiarities but after finally fixing the phantom parasitic power draw she has been ready to hit the road every time I roll up the garage. Back to my original question, I do have a tach and I make a point to not push her over 2500-2700 rpm. So, yes you guys are so right...whats the damn rush....need to get that on a t-shirt so I can can remember to remember. As usual, thanks again for the sound advise you guys dispatch. You are all a wealth of knowledge and wisdom...

I don't know when man invented the wheel. BUT, I would bet someone soon after attached 4 of them to a board and went down a hill. Soon, the boards became very expensive vehicles for the rich only. Then came the man. Henry Ford. He came up with a car that most could afford. AND, along with that car, came those who were not satisfied with the top speed available. Probably some teenager like I was.
You can follow all those guys who never accepted the as built top speeds. How fast it will go has always been there. Now that I am 73 years old, I realize not everyone feels the same about cars as I do. I drove the stock Falcon with its steering, stopping and going issues and knew that was not what I would want. BUT, thousands of others want exactly that.
I grew up with brothers and a dad who raced. When I was 17 I bought a 1957 Chevy and made it the best looking car in Wichita Kansas and one of the fastest. I along with my wife were drag racing it constantly. When racing and fast cars are in your blood line you are what you are.
I never think ill of anyone with a totally restored Falcon and compliment their cars and talk about all the time and effort to get their dreams fulfilled. BUT, I have had many, and I will say MANY Falcon owners say horrible things to me because I DARED to destroy my car.
I had an older gentleman, (older than me) spend 30 minutes going over my car belittling every aspect of what I did. This was in Arizona at a car show where I won best of show. I asked him if he had a car and he took me to a round body Falcon (not sure of year). It was a total piece of crap. Nothing was fixed in the 50 years since it was built. I didn't say a single bad thing about his car. An hour later he showed up again to continue his barrage of complaints.
I asked him how many hours he spent getting his car to look like it does. He wouldn't answer. I told him I had spent literally thousands of hours on mine. (of course he said all my hours were wasted).
By this time I was just tired of listening and asked him to go puke on someone else's car.
I have worked a little on the most stock Falcon in this club, and it is beautiful. More importantly the reason for it being totally stock and restored is MUCH more important that my reason to change mine.
My next car will be highly modified. Which is one reason it has taken me so long to find the right car. I didn't want to cut up a beautiful restorable Falcon and waited for one that fit my wish list. It will be loud, high and fast. For me. Larry

Larry, There are purists out there, but it sounds to me you ran into a pukist. So dissatisfied with his he had to belittle someone else who built what he wished he could, but couldn't for - whatever reason. The thing I've learned, time and time again, is the ones complaining and pointing fingers are the ones actually doing what they are complaining about, or wish they could.

I say, if you build it, build it safe to do whatever you want it to do. When I was 17 I got my first Falcon, a '62 Futura tudor coupe, for $50. I'd just wrapped my Fairlane around a phone pole of a bleak foggy night and needed a car; one I hoped I could use parts from the Fairlane on. Being a poor 17 y.o. kid I couldn't afford much, but I cobbled together a pretty fast car. I worked at an auto parts store and my boss let me buy parts at his cost. So I built a pretty decent 289... but the things I couldn't (or didn't) buy was the things that made that motor a safe thing in that car. I remember racing a 240Z (they were new back then) and though I beat that car by a long-shot... I remember thinking to myself "that was scary as heck." I mean, I had a too wide Fairlane rear-end and 4-lug front suspension and that thing was unsafe at any speed. It wasn't until I got older that I really started focusing on the actual "mechanics" of what I was doing, even though at the time I was doing it I knew better... just couldn't afford what my brain said was the right thing to do. I know better now, I hope.

Regarding the original question, I think a stock 170/Ford-O-Matic (as you've found out) is about the bare minimum for freeway travel these days. But unless you're trying to keep your car all stock, there are plenty of parts available to pep up your engine and still keep it reliable. Since an engine is basically an air pump, getting larger volumes of air in & out will give you more horsepower. A slightly larger carb and a freer-flowing exhaust system would help, without having to go inside the engine. A numerically lower differential gear would reduce rpms, but wouldn't help much in the hills.

Even though my Ranchero is a V8 car and I drive it a ton, I try to avoid freeways, as it's no fun just droning along on a freeway. Back roads & small towns are the best way to see America.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by beerbelly

...I try to avoid freeways, as it's no fun just droning along on a freeway. Back roads & small towns are the best way to see America.

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I can't agree more. I avoid the freeways unless there is no choice... or I'm in my newer car.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by beerbelly

I try to avoid freeways, as it's no fun just droning along on a freeway. Back roads & small towns are the best way to see America.

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I'm guessing not only America :)
I've been in Belgium, Germany and Luxembourgh with my falcon. Always fun, usually thumbs up and nice reactions, but driving local roads is most satisfying. You also get to see something of the countryside and need less attention on the road (ok bar a winding moutain road).

Yes, as per BeerBelly & Luva65wagon's comments on the slight non intrusive modifications and sticking to the streets. Since she is a 170 with Clifford header dual exhaust, an autolite 1 bbl, stock gearing in the axel and still running 14" wheels I think I have exhausted the non intrusive mods (for now). Slow and steady as she goes it is then. One other thing I was starting to look at or perhaps consider but then again that is a totally separate project. I've been reading about these Aussie Ford engines called "Barra". They are a discontinued Ford engine that was widely used in Australia in some of their general lineups. They generate about 240 HP and that is without any modifications. They are still an inline straight six and you can even find them with a turbo (300+ HP). They seem to ship containers of these Barra's to the US. An average cost is between 800-1200 depending on the miles on the used motors. I thought this may be a way to go if I want to have a freeway flyer, until I stepped back and assessed what would need to be touched in order to convert to a Barra in which case I may be better off just finding a pre loved Falcon with a 260 and squeeze her into the garage. I guess this is the excuse I will use to get another Falcon [thumb]

I have been into cars since I was 8 years old. I helped my dad work on his cars and motorcycles . I'm 70 years old now and still can't own a car,bike or gun without doing something to make it my own .I still love to check out pure stock cars and bikes ,but it's just not my cup of tea.As far as how fast to drive one of these old falcons. My dad gave my sister a 62 falcon four door. She drove the wheels off it. She drove it from Haleyville Al to Detroit two times and from Haleyville Al to Hollywood Fl at least three times . She drove that car at 65-70 about every where she went.She had that car for at least 6 years and sold it running. Those little 6 banger by ford are pretty tuff. Roger

I am another who can't leave well enough alone. I am building my 62 Ranchero to replace a 5.0L Ranger pickup i used to have with something a little more classic and hopefully looking less like a truck (aka:free moving service)
The Ranger had an 87 5.0 with a carb and B303 cam, a T5 and a narrowed 8.8 with 3.73 gears. It ran mid 12's and got better gas mileage than the four banger did for the previous owner, who could only use 5th gear on a downhill highway stretch.

So the Ranchero is also getting a 5.0L with a carb and bigger cam, a T5 and a 9" with 4.33 Detroit Locker. Hoping it will be a bit faster, mileage may suffer a little.

A guy in the local Falcon club used to daily drive a two door wagon that had a 3.0L Ranger V6 and 5 speed. You just never see that engine swapped into anything but the logic was great. It's like driving a 90 Ranger but in a classier car.

I sold some parts to a guy who was building a 60 Falcon on a Tempo platform! He had the rusty floor all gone and Tempo cut off at the rockers and . The body was hung from the rafter in the garage and the ussue seemed to be the forward position of the engine left no space for the rad. Seemed like a really odd swap but the Tempo was a drivable car that a tree fell on, the Falcon was almost scrap in a field. No idea if he ever finished it.