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Thread: Tie rod ends. L & R, or not?

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  1. #1

    Tie rod ends. L & R, or not?

    Here is a puzzle. Falcon Parts uses one tie rod end for both the left and right side. Mac's auto parts sells two different tie rod ends, one for the left and one for the right. Which do you think is correct?

    Falcon Parts:
    Tie rods outer (2) 1963-1964 V-8 MANUAL STEERING OUTER TIE ROD ENDS SKU: C3DZ-3A130-G This part serves as the left hand or right hand outer tie rod end for all models of the 1963 & 1964 Ford Falcon & Mercury Comet equipped with a V-8 engine & manual steering. It is also used as the right hand outer tie rod end on all models of the 1963 & 1964 Ford Falcon & Mercury Comet equipped with a V-8 engine & power steering. The adjusting threads on this tie rod end are RIGHT Hand. Falcon Parts $87.95 x 2 = $175.90.
    See: http://www.falconparts.com/ford-falc...DS-197p533.htm

    Macs:
    Outer Tie Rods - Manual Steering
    Macs 1963 V8 Right, Falcon 41-35548-2 $94.95
    1963 V8 Left, Falcon 41-35550-2 $116.95

    See: http://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_fa...e+rod&x=16&y=8
    Dennis Pierson
    Tampa, FL
    "The Wonder Falcon"

    '63 Futura Hardtop (260, Ford-O-Matic, bench seat)

  2. #2
    I know in 1965 the two inner are the same and the two outer are the same - if you have manual steering, but I'm not so sure earlier models. I installed '65 manual parts on my '63. The '64 parts are one-off and may carry back into '63 cars too. They did weird stuff those years. If they look identical (thread size and rotation, length, bends) then they likely are the same. Power steering car, not so.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Federal Way
    Posts
    906
    I have been very impressed with the falconparts guys when I have a question. They are still owned by the guys who started the company because they loved falcons. Each time, I get the feeling they know the answer, and each time I found what they said to be correct-as far as I could tell. It seems like with the MAC's people, sometimes they're reading the answer from the same catalog you are. If you have any question about it, I would email the falconparts.com guy directly- I have always gotten an answer quickly.
    Don Bartlett
    Federal Way, WA
    61 Four Door Sedan
    144-6, 3 on the tree



  4. #4

    Rebuilding the Front End

    Hello, Roger and Don.

    Thanks for the input. I believe that Falcon Parts is correct and that the left and right outer tie rod ends are the same based on the following picture. I bought a CD called "1960-1968 Ford Car, Part Diagrams and Exploded Views" and found a page labeled "1963/64 Manual Steering Linkage (Falcon 8 Cylinder)". The diagram labels the outer tie rod ends as "3289" and the inner tie rod ends as "3290". That indicates to me that there is no left or right, just two each of inner and outer.
    1960 - 1968 Ford Car Parts Diagram.jpg

    My front tires are wearing on the inside edge and it turns out that my ball joints are worn out. That's no surprise. The whole front end is worn out. Rather than just change the ball joints, I am looking at re-doing everything on the front. Here is the parts list that I have.

    Have I missed anything?
    Should I change the front coil springs "while I am at it"? The existing coil springs seem alright.

    1. Upper control arms with ball joints and bushings (2)
    2. Lower control arms with ball joints and bushings (2)
    3. Sway bar mount bushings (2)
    4. Sway bar link kit (1)
    5. Strut rod bushings (2)
    6. Coil springs (2)
    7. Coil spring perch (2)
    8. Front suspension bumper (2)
    9. Engine mounts (2)
    10. Idler arm
    11. Pitman arm
    12. Tie rod ends inner (2)
    13. Tie rod ends outer (2)
    14. Tie rod sleeve (2)
    15. Top coil spring insulator (2)
    16. Shocks, front and rear

    Here are some photos of the existing parts. I stuck my head under the car last night while it was in the garage and tried to identify the parts that I was reading about. I've never had time to pay attention to the front end until now and it is all really interesting to read about what each part does and how they all fit together.

    Here is the idler arm. The long rod in the background is the center link. Wikipedia says: "The idler arm supports the end of the center link on the passengers side of the vehicle. The idler arm bolts to the vehicle's frame or subframe. Generally, an idler arm is attached between the opposite side of the center link from the Pitman arm and the vehicle's frame to hold the center link at the proper height. Idler arms are generally more vulnerable to wear than Pitman arms because of the pivot function built into them. If the idler arm is fitted with grease fittings, these should be lubricated with a grease gun at each oil change."
    2 Idler arm right side to center link.jpg

    Pitman arm to center link. The tie rod adjusting sleeve is in the center background. "The Pitman arm is a linkage attached to the steering box (see recirculating ball) sector shaft, that converts the angular motion of the sector shaft into the linear motion needed to steer the wheels." ** "1963 ½ Falcon V-8 vehicles used 1 1/8 inch sectors shafts, six cylinder cars used a one-inch shaft."
    Pitman arm to center link.jpg

    This shows the strut rod connection to the lower control arm. The bolt sticking up is the sway bar link. A ball joint is on the right.
    Strut rod to lower control arm 5.jpg

    Upper control arm. The coil spring sits on a "perch" positioned on top of the upper control arm. The ball joint is on the right in the photo and the pivot bolt is on the left.
    Upper Control Arm.jpg
    Last edited by ew1usnr; August 5th, 2014 at 04:31 PM.
    Dennis Pierson
    Tampa, FL
    "The Wonder Falcon"

    '63 Futura Hardtop (260, Ford-O-Matic, bench seat)

  5. #5
    If your coil spring perches are the original bronze bushing type I'd re use those or go with the opentracker roller perches.

    The replacement bushing type in my personal opinion don't rotate as well as the bronze bushing type do and puts the suspension in a bind. Plus they have a tendency to squeak.

    opentracker is expensive at $119 a pair.. and a little overkill for a street car, but are a good alternative.

    Finding NOS bronze bushing type perches is difficult at best. So unless yours are real sloppy lots of play in the cross shaft the rides on the bushings I say clean them up and reuse them.

    Just my opinion though.
    Nathan and Jen Cooper
    63 Sprint Hardtop "Dollora"
    63 Super deluxe squire wagon "Mayble"
    * this spot is vacant for future project*

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Federal Way
    Posts
    906
    Dennis,
    You'll be amazed at what that stuff will look like powdercoated. It's not that expensive either. I'm a rookie at this stuff, but I'm figuring it out step by step. I have all the front suspension stuff powder coated (except I replaced the control arms in one piece.) The stuff is so beautiful I'm going to hate to put the fender back over it after I get it put back together! I just made the decision to do it all from the ground up. (By the way...those ball joints were horrible...old hardened grease...and the shocks were totally spent. Whatever was in them was long gone...) Now I'm focused on the rear axle...almost done. Some pics below- you can see what a beauty it is now. You can imagine what it looked like before, and it was rancid inside. Of course, it could all fall apart when I get going if I screwed it up...but I don't think so. Before it was very sloppy. Huge play at the yoke, and one axle shaft wobbled. I replaced all the bearings, but kept the origional yoke and pinion based on members recomendations, I carefully put everything together by the book, youtube videos, and recomendations from others (carefully setting all torque...) Low and behold...that big slop is gone, and everything seems to work great...(on the bench anyway...) unfortunately I probably won't find out until late next spring, but I'm already getting pretty excited.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Don Bartlett
    Federal Way, WA
    61 Four Door Sedan
    144-6, 3 on the tree



  7. #7

    Perches

    Quote Originally Posted by Nathan289 View Post
    If your coil spring perches are the original bronze bushing type I'd re use those or go with the opentracker roller perches.

    The replacement bushing type in my personal opinion don't rotate as well as the bronze bushing type do and puts the suspension in a bind. Plus they have a tendency to squeak.

    opentracker is expensive at $119 a pair.. and a little overkill for a street car, but are a good alternative.
    Hello, Nathan.

    Youch! The opentracker roller perches are $199 a pair. See: http://www.opentrackerracingproducts.com/rollerperch/
    roller bearing spring perches.jpg

    And there is a double roller perch for $300, see: http://www.mustangsplus.com/xcart/19...r-Bearing.html
    The price for a TRIPLE roller perch must really be up there.

    Then there are the cheapie rubber bushing pieces that cost $39 a pair on ebay.
    ebay spring perches .94.jpg

    You are correct that the original pieces rotated on a metal shaft and bushings shaft (see diagram below). That indicates that the piece was intended to rotate freely. Whether my car still has the original piece or not has yet to be discovered.
    60 - 65 Suspension.jpg

    But .... I read that the rubber-bushings have advantages over the metal bushings or roller bearings in that the rubber bushings insulate the car from road noise, they cannot be damaged by a sudden shock as can bearings, and they do not require lubrication as do the bearings.

    The roller bearings do rotate more freely, and I am trying to understand how that lessens "bind" in the suspension and what effect that would have on handling. The bottom of the shock absorber bolts (I think) to the spring perch and if the perch does not rotate freely its angle will change as the control arm moves up and down. This would put a small amount of twist on both the coil spring and the shock absorber. I guess that the twist would work against keeping the tires square on the road and would make the car feel less stable.

    Does that reasoning sound correct? Could you really feel a difference in your car's handling after installing roller bearing spring perches?

    Note to Don.

    All you powder coating looks really nice. I'm looking forward to your getting your car back on the road and you posting pictures of the trips that you will take it on.
    Last edited by ew1usnr; August 6th, 2014 at 08:04 PM.
    Dennis Pierson
    Tampa, FL
    "The Wonder Falcon"

    '63 Futura Hardtop (260, Ford-O-Matic, bench seat)

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