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Thread: Call me crazy - Ranchero's (again)

  1. #676
    Sadly, I went out last night to start it and "ramp test it" and couldn't get it to go into any gears. Seems the clutch doesn't disengage enough to go into gear. And these things will not even let you grind gears - though I could somewhat trying reverse. There must be some lock-out in these to prevent you from doing that.

    I may need to adjust the clutch some, but I'm not all up on these new-fangled clutch systems where I read the throw-out bearing is supposed to be engaged and pre-loaded all the time. And if so, how much? Anybody out there been down this road already?

    I may still have some air in the system too. The bleeder is at the bottom of my setup, which was my bad. Something I should have known better for. Looking at Rock-Auto and then ordering isn't always a perfect science. Anyway, going to make a tool to block-off the plunger (it can't move at all while bleeding the clutch slave) and do another round of bleeding... and study this clutch pre-load thing. I just hope the setup I built from Rock Auto parts has enough throw - period. That would be a bummer.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  2. #677
    Had to make a longer clutch slave push-rod to give me more adjustment, which also allowed me to file a flat on the end of it to slip a wrench over to hold the rod in place while adjusting the two nuts. Was able to adjust it to go into gear, shift, stall, reverse. All good there now.

    So, now I get to play musical cars, probably Friday. As any of you know who've been at my place - gotta do as much testing in the garage as I can. Once I'm down the hill, there's no easy getting it back up the hill.

    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  3. #678
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Mill Creek
    Posts
    1,224

    Call me crazy - Ranchero's (again)

    Yeah, your driveway is not a place to test it. Your information about the preload on the throw out bearing is interesting. I am not sure I have mine set up correctly. It doesn't want to shift into gears without a little grinding. I will investigate to see if I need to adjust that preload into it. Let me know if there is some way I can help. Larry
    Larry Smith
    1964 Futura
    347 stroker



  4. #679
    Larry,

    This adjustment and the required travel is very elusive. Factory cars with cable clutches are all self adjusting from what I can see - probably some foot poundage needs to be seen or something to adjust these. So any discussion I found was on how these work. But I have searched and searched and as much speculation as there is questions if you have an external slave. Lots of people do it with a variety of OEM style parts and expensive aftermarket parts - but even MDL seems to simply go as far as advertise what they offer, but then don't elaborate on any of the actual adjustment - at least on their site. I'm sure I could email Paul at MDL and get some answers, which I may do.

    After spending more time last night searching on-line I began to doubt what I've done, even. Travel of the cable or mc/slave (or lack thereof) can contribute adjustment issues too. A few places say you have to have 1.25-1.5" of travel. Not sure what I have, so am going to measure it.

    You have the cable designed for this application (as opposed to my "try to do it on the cheap with OEM parts"), so as much as I did find would suggest you have to have a preload on these bearings if you have the pressure plate with lots of fingers. Apparently the bearings are designed for and can handle this constant rotation. The 3-finger pressure plates of old required a gap between the TOB and the fingers.

    But yeah, not being on "much" level surface to test this out - or anything I've ever done while living here - has always caused me to constantly second-guess just about ever thing I do.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  5. #680
    No test driving yet.

    I needed to do a lot more clean-up of my pathway out of my garage (amazing how much can collect in 4 months), which also caused me to start second-guessing myself. I've been reading where folks say I need between 1.25 and 1.5" of clutch-arm travel to fully disengage the clutch. So when I measured I have about a half-inch. I know I should have a lot more even with the parts I used, but makes me think I have still some air trapped in there. I simply adjusted it to the point I could get the clutch to release, but it may not be fully engaging - even though I was able to stall the motor.

    So... I went back to Rock Auto and noticed I can get the same slave I got for a Mazda MPV, but with the bleeder on the top (4WD version). So I've got that coming as well as another of the same M/C. At only $20 for the pair I want to do some more specific measuring with all this new information I have and see what the actual strokes are on these parts.

    Looking more like a spring test drive to me all the time.

    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  6. #681
    Happy New Year! It's been cold here so far, and I did a lot of traveling during the holiday, but I did get out there are fabricate a lever to make my too-short-stroke clutch slave into one that will do the job just fine. Works great. I opted to make a video of it and upload it if anyone cares to look at what I did. And yes, I cut-up a wrench to do it.

    https://youtu.be/q_ymbmNuGqY

    After staring at things some more last night and pondering why some of my header clearances are tighter now, and things seem to be be more forward now, I think it's because of my transmission mount, which I modified from the C4 to use on the T5. I think I need to remove it and elongate the holes another 1/2" and move everything back that much. I have room on the drive-shaft to do so and will need to modify a little of the floor opening, but it's too cold to drive it. Might as well.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  7. #682
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Seattle
    Posts
    1,430
    That's not the special Drop Forged 19mm combination wrench I lent you is it?

    Jeff Watson
    Seattle, WA
    '63 Tudor Wagon (170 - 3 spd.)

  8. #683
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Mill Creek
    Posts
    1,224

    Call me crazy - Ranchero's (again)

    Beautiful work as usual Roger. Jeff will forgive you if it works. Happy New Year and can't wait to get rid of this cold weather. I have a heated new garage and still don't want to go out there. Larry
    Larry Smith
    1964 Futura
    347 stroker



  9. #684
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    East Wenatchee
    Posts
    37
    Know the feeling as our highs this week are supposed to be in the mid-teens. Been turning on the heaters (two of them) when I get home lately so I can start on my winter projects. I've put it off too long already and spring is around the corner.

  10. #685
    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff W View Post
    That's not the special Drop Forged 19mm combination wrench I lent you is it?
    Naw - it was the 19mm and 17mm double open-end wrench you loaned me. I can give you the 17mm part back if you want it. It has a hole drilled in it though. Drilling the wrench was fun. Thankfully my tool-shop coworker had a special bit to cut that.

    Temp in the garage is kept just between 45 and 55 this time of the year using just a small portable radiant oil filled heater. Garage walls are insulated, but never got it up to the roof like I wanted to someday. It's cold for sure, but as I see it this makes me work faster.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  11. #686
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferari View Post
    Know the feeling as our highs this week are supposed to be in the mid-teens.
    Not the same area, I know, but was in the Tri-Cities on Sat/Sun for New year's and we left for Seattle just after the Seahawks game. Had been snowing all day, but was near white-out by the time we reached Yakima. Lots of cold in the Cascades and over. Lucky we left when we did as they closed the freeway not long after.

    Stay warm!
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  12. #687

    While I'm At it...

    Never able to leave well enough alone (although that makes no sense; because if it was 'well enough' I WOULD leave it alone) I proceeded last week to move my whole engine and transmission rearward 3/4" to improve some clearance issues I was having. I started by pulling the transmission mount and elongating the mount slots only to find the motor mount bolts were all the way back in their holes. DOH! I come to find out that the motor mount angle-plates (between the rubber and the frame supports) can go on either side, and when you reverse them they offset almost an inch where the motor lands. They've been backwards all along. So out come the mounts (that's fun to do with headers on the engine) and swap them around. Headers and everything fits so much better now.

    Of course, what you do down-yonder has to be adjusted up-top as well, so I had to make the back part of the hole in the floor longer and clearance some more of my already hacked carpet.

    And I thought since I had to pull the console again, which I had shortened to accommodate the T5 shifter location in the first place, I'd improve it a little. I didn't like how I left it. Of course, when I went to reinstall the improved version... that 3/4" made it too close to the shifter and it now needs to get moved back too. Sigh.

    And the carpet has now gone through a 4-speed factory shifter (hump in the floor), C4 B&M shifter (hump still in the floor, but not needed, 4-speed hole patched), and now a T5 (hump in the floor, but not needed, lots of holes from C4 install)... with all the patching I've done in the carpet along the way... I may as well pull the hump, patch the floor, and put in new carpet; of the hump-less version. So new carpet is ordered. No miscellaneous patched places in the carpet - and I can probably sell the hump for the same cost as the carpet.

    Maybe then I can leave this alone for a while...

    ...yeah, right.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  13. #688
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Mill Creek
    Posts
    1,224

    Call me crazy - Ranchero's (again)

    Yeah, right. You will do what you always do. Make it better and more beautiful. It is amazing watching your knowledge and ability to improve this car. Larry
    Larry Smith
    1964 Futura
    347 stroker



  14. #689

    Floor re-do

    Took out all the carpet and pulled the shift-hump out. That'll go to swap meet or eBay unless anyone needs one here. Then hammered out a new tunnel hole cover and then a better (taller) tail-shaft/shifter boot cover. Then I covered all the exposed floor with Dynamat. Didn't realize how much of the floor I had left bare before. Should be a lot quieter in there now.

    floor redo.jpg

    Just waiting now for the replacement carpet, which should be here any day. That will go in pretty fast and then I can finally put this car on the ground!

    Unless I find something else to do to it.

    All I can say is it felt good to pound on something as I watched the Seahawks lose on Saturday.
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



  15. #690

    Now... I think I'm done

    ... for now.

    I spent last night and today getting my new carpet in. So much better without the "hump" (with all the extra holes). Gosh, I might really drive it again...



    So now comes the car swapping (and a bunch o stuff to remove from off the cars) to get the wagon into the garage for some "undoing" of some of what I've done to it so I can get it listed.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Roger Moore

    63 "Flarechero"
    powered by: 347ci stroker | Tremec T5 | 8" 3:45 TracLoc rear



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